Was The Offseason Strategy Driven By Les Snead's Desire To Save His Job?
  • Wildflecken
    Bench Warmer
    Posts: 1138
    Joined: 03 Feb 2016, 04:07

    Was The Offseason Strategy Driven By Les Snead's Desire To Save His Job?

    by Wildflecken » 15 Jul 2017, 11:00

    I want to preface this thread with the statement I like Les Snead. I liked Jeff Fisher as well but this is a results driven business and when an organization decides to go in a different direction they show no mercy. Personal relationships do not enter the equation.

    When Fisher was let go during the 2016 season, Les Snead had to know his seat was getting warm. Then in January his current boss announced he may be replacing himself on that side of the empire with a new hire. A position above the GM and a position the GM reports too. History suggests when new hires in this business are made at that level they bring in personnel they are familiar working with, Someone who they have worked with in the past and they have complete confidence and trust in. After all the football operations encompass all decisions related to the roster, retention of existing talent, FA, draft, the UDFA program cap management etc.

    Assuming Demoff does follow through on making this hire he announced to the media in January of 2017, Les Snead will have to defend the decisions he has made during his tenure as the General Manager shortly thereafter. He would not be able to defend the first five seasons of decisions if he would of decided to build for 2018 and beyond this past off season. No Les Snead needed to try to make the playoffs in 2017. You could sense the urgency in his decisions this past off season. And that is why the Rams need to make this hire sooner rather than later. Patchwork mentality works for playoff teams. Pittsburgh seeking the talent in 2017 to get them past NE in the playoffs, NE upgrading some key positions as their coach does not expect another miracle in the 2017 playoffs etc.. But is a short term mentality the proper approach for an organization that has not made the playoffs in the number of years the Rams have not? Would signing a pro bowl OG in Zeitler to a long term deal be a better move for this organization in FA than signing an OT on the wrong side of 35? A pro bowl OG who fits the power gap to be installed by the new regime?

    Demoff needs to make this hire ASAP. Accountability and doing whats best for the organization does not start and end with the players on the roster. It applies to everyone in the organization. The short range plan must mesh with the decisions that are best for the organization in long range plan. From a business perspective the long range plan is being well monitored. The new venue, the agreement with the Chargers, the international games and exposure, but who is managing the long range plan for the football operations? If Demoff had made this hire prior to the start of Free Agency would the strategy this off season have been different? I am curious to the forums take here

    Go Rams!
  • Ram Stien
    Rookie
    Posts: 167
    Joined: 23 Jan 2016, 07:20

    Re: Was The Offseason Strategy Driven By Les Snead's Desire To Save His Job?

    by Ram Stien » 15 Jul 2017, 13:35

    I think Fisher had the final say in personal matters his stubbornness and unwillingness to change with the NFL led to his demise. Also a head coach is only as good as his assistant coaches. I think the Rams did a good job in the off season, the trade of Robinson who I'm sure Fisher pushed for is addition by subtraction. Also I thought they did well in the draft with their limited number of picks, got Goff some weapons and gave Wade some nice pieces.
  • poplarbluffman
    Bench Warmer
    Posts: 1195
    Joined: 23 Jan 2016, 09:02

    Re: Was The Offseason Strategy Driven By Les Snead's Desire To Save His Job?

    by poplarbluffman » 15 Jul 2017, 16:03

    amen....agree sound logic Snead needs to win now more then McVay does give us a logical explanation for many of the decisions so far....

    thought I might start a thread about this but wanted your thoughts..Rams only have 2 qb's on the roster right now and camp starts in a couple of weeks..Kaepernick? Sure looks like they have some vet qb in mind. Snead/McVay can't be remotely comfortable with only Goff and Mannion Kaepernick would have a chip on his shoulder especially vs West div teams
  • Commish
    Rookie
    Posts: 661
    Joined: 05 Aug 2016, 12:00
    Location: Texas Gulf Coast

    Re: Was The Offseason Strategy Driven By Les Snead's Desire To Save His Job?

    by Commish » 15 Jul 2017, 16:17

    I think Fisher had the final say in personal matters his stubbornness and unwillingness to change with the NFL led to his demise. Also a head coach is only as good as his assistant coaches. I think the Rams did a good job in the off season, the trade of Robinson who I'm sure Fisher pushed for is addition by subtraction. Also I thought they did well in the draft with their limited number of picks, got Goff some weapons and gave Wade some nice pieces.
    Agreed--especially RE guys like Wade Phillips, Matt LaFleur, John Fassel, Aaron Kromer, Greg Olsen, etc.... :) 8-) :idea:

    RAM POWER!!

    --The Commish
    McCOY: "Do you think that's all they ever had?"
    KIRK: "No, but it's all they had left."
  • Claremontram
    Rookie
    Posts: 653
    Joined: 03 Feb 2015, 11:57

    Re: Was The Offseason Strategy Driven By Les Snead's Desire To Save His Job?

    by Claremontram » 15 Jul 2017, 17:49

    I would love to see Kap brought in as a back-up to Goff. Jury still out on Goff. Need to see real improvement.

    As far as Snead goes, don't know what influence he had in the Fisher regime. I think the acquisition of a vet LT and C were absolutely necessary. Wish we had a scary fast WR to back off these defenses.
  • Wildflecken
    Bench Warmer
    Posts: 1138
    Joined: 03 Feb 2016, 04:07

    Re: Was The Offseason Strategy Driven By Les Snead's Desire To Save His Job?

    by Wildflecken » 16 Jul 2017, 03:28

    This thread was not started to rehash the all too tired whose to blame for the draft picks under the last regime. One I believe Snead himself already answered this to the public and two we seen with the new regime it was a similar approach. The coaching staff (HC) gives the GM his priorities for upcoming season and Snead and scouting department find the players who fit the coaches desires and together they collectively make the decision at the top of the draft. The difference McVay uses technology to show the GM what he needs, Fisher did not. Snead stated he had better understanding of new regimes needs.

    The thread was intended to discuss the strategy this past offseason, the first under the new regime, and specifically the strategy in FA.
    Those who read my posts know my take on the offensive line. And as I have stated in the past, it all does start at LOT. NEVER have I seen an offensive line finish the season in the top five or even top 10 without solid play at the LOT position. So I understand the Whitworth signing. It would be extremely hard to evaluate what they have with Goff without some form of solid play at LOT. But it is fair to discuss the fact he is on the wrong side of 35 and there were some quality interior lineman in this FA class, specifically Zeitler who is young and was entering second contract and is perfect fit in a power gap design. A talent who could be superior to Schreff in WA who they drafted at five overall in draft. Even the diehard Rams fans on this forum are not giving the Rams much of a chance to make playoffs in 2017. In fact I seem to be the only one willing to go out on a limb and predict they will. So would a signing like Zeitler been better use of the FA dollars? A talent who could solve an interior spot for 5 to 10 seasons with Pro Bowl caliber play? Loved the Woods signing as he was entering second contract. Like that signing more than most on this forum. Rams could of taken a different path in short term at LOT and added Kevin Zeitler, and if all agree they are not making playoffs in 2017 then would that of been the better decision?

    These are the discussions I was attempting to start, not to rehash the all too tired whose to blame for last regimes failures. Its done, over, and no matter how much it is discussed wont change the outcome.
  • Fletch59
    Rookie
    Posts: 639
    Joined: 16 Jan 2015, 09:20
    Location: st. Albans wv

    Re: Was The Offseason Strategy Driven By Les Snead's Desire To Save His Job?

    by Fletch59 » 16 Jul 2017, 06:55

    I'm with Wild, I'm in the 10 - 6 camp. What happened in the past is done. Don't give a rats hiney. I think the off season was a huge success toward changing the losing culture and it will show this year! They did more than just tweak the OL. Sure I would've liked younger talent, but we did need solid vets like Whit and Sully. Plus Kromer and the other coaches...it's gonna be like night and day difference on the field. Go RAMS!
    Krapperdick doesn't seem like a fit for McVay. Don't care for that move at ALL.
    GO RAMS!
  • User avatar
    LARAMSinFebruary
    Rookie
    Posts: 26
    Joined: 27 Mar 2016, 13:48

    Re: Was The Offseason Strategy Driven By Les Snead's Desire To Save His Job?

    by LARAMSinFebruary » 16 Jul 2017, 07:29

    Giving Goff a chance to develop was kind of an emergency situation for any GM; the diff. between Robinson and Whitworth is greater than a guard replacement in terms of that. I don't think any GM would've had the luxury of thinking very long-term about the line as opposed to Goff's development. He had a rough very rookie year, and its hard to say how much of it was the abysmal OL.
  • User avatar
    LARAMSinFebruary
    Rookie
    Posts: 26
    Joined: 27 Mar 2016, 13:48

    Re: Was The Offseason Strategy Driven By Les Snead's Desire To Save His Job?

    by LARAMSinFebruary » 16 Jul 2017, 07:37


    Agreed--especially RE guys like Wade Phillips, Matt LaFleur, John Fassel, Aaron Kromer, Greg Olsen, etc.... :) 8-)
    The Rams definitely hit the bonanza in coaching. Hope they all sync together to form a winning core for years to come. Even if Phillips retires he was the perfect catch to balance out McVay's inexperience. If our weaknesses were QB who needs development and OL we really nailed it.
  • Commish
    Rookie
    Posts: 661
    Joined: 05 Aug 2016, 12:00
    Location: Texas Gulf Coast

    Re: Was The Offseason Strategy Driven By Les Snead's Desire To Save His Job?

    by Commish » 16 Jul 2017, 10:00

    Giving Goff a chance to develop was kind of an emergency situation for any GM; the diff. between Robinson and Whitworth is greater than a guard replacement in terms of that. I don't think any GM would've had the luxury of thinking very long-term about the line as opposed to Goff's development. He had a rough very rookie year, and its hard to say how much of it was the abysmal OL.
    ++++!! Exactly!

    If Jared Goff's development is the central basis of our team's rebuilding effort, then getting him significantly improved pass protection (notably at the LT and center positions) IMMEDIATELY is critical to the Rams this year.

    Signing Andrew Whitworth and John Sullivan presumably has bought the McVay/Phillips regime another couple of seasons to address more long-term solutions at their positions, while Goff hopefully continues to develop at QB... :) 8-) :idea:

    RAM POWER!!

    --The Commish
    McCOY: "Do you think that's all they ever had?"
    KIRK: "No, but it's all they had left."
  • User avatar
    sdram
    Bench Warmer
    Posts: 1721
    Joined: 12 Jan 2015, 03:42

    Re: Was The Offseason Strategy Driven By Les Snead's Desire To Save His Job?

    by sdram » 16 Jul 2017, 18:13

    ...a chance to make playoffs in 2017. In fact I seem to be the only one willing to go out on a limb and predict they will.
    Nice post WF. I like seeing a positive outlook here. Having been disappointed over and over the last 12 years I think I'll wait before making any predictions. The definition of insanity seems to fit here regarding being too optimistic before training camp even begins.

    Go RAMS!!!
  • grackler
    Rookie
    Posts: 174
    Joined: 17 Jan 2015, 13:25

    What has Snead been these past five seasons? A deaf/dumb, well-coiffed cupie doll?? Nonsense...

    by grackler » 17 Jul 2017, 21:04

    If all Snead did these past five season was grow a head of hair and stand by while Fisher screwed the pooch with way too many wasted draft picks, then he needed to be fired. Alternately, if he actively participated along with Fisher in producing five seasons of futility than he should also have been fired. Either way, if the Rams organization were really serious about producing a winner, Snead (and Demoff) should have been ushered out with Fisher.

    Instead (and unbelievably), those two proven losers were retained and allowed to select Fisher's successor. Just fricking unreal, and NO OTHER NFL organization except the Rams would have proceeded in such a pathetic fashion.

    Personally, I don't see hiring a 32 yr old first-time head coach and moving a few players around as likely to contribute much, if anything to our Rams ever becoming winners. IMO, nothing will change until someone with proven football knowledge and front-office power takes over.

    Finally, I'm a die-hard Ram fan since 1955(!) and would love nothing more than to be proven totally wrong about all this.
  • poplarbluffman
    Bench Warmer
    Posts: 1195
    Joined: 23 Jan 2016, 09:02

    Re: Was The Offseason Strategy Driven By Les Snead's Desire To Save His Job?

    by poplarbluffman » 18 Jul 2017, 03:22

    Fisher has become the teams scapegoat..all decisions were on him...even not drafting Wagner was part of that plan..Fisher really wanted Isaiah Pead all along...and when Fisher had to ask Demoff's premission to draft Mo Alexander in the 4th rd he was only pretending. Fisher only wanted to make Demoff feel important.


    yep, Fisher had total control alright
  • Massimo
    Rookie
    Posts: 431
    Joined: 09 Mar 2016, 06:55

    Re: What has Snead been these past five seasons? A deaf/dumb, well-coiffed cupie doll?? Nonsense...

    by Massimo » 18 Jul 2017, 05:45

    If all Snead did these past five season was grow a head of hair and stand by while Fisher screwed the pooch with way too many wasted draft picks, then he needed to be fired. Alternately, if he actively participated along with Fisher in producing five seasons of futility than he should also have been fired. Either way, if the Rams organization were really serious about producing a winner, Snead (and Demoff) should have been ushered out with Fisher.

    Instead (and unbelievably), those two proven losers were retained and allowed to select Fisher's successor. Just fricking unreal, and NO OTHER NFL organization except the Rams would have proceeded in such a pathetic fashion.

    Personally, I don't see hiring a 32 yr old first-time head coach and moving a few players around as likely to contribute much, if anything to our Rams ever becoming winners. IMO, nothing will change until someone with proven football knowledge and front-office power takes over.

    Finally, I'm a die-hard Ram fan since 1955(!) and would love nothing more than to be proven totally wrong about all this.
    I've been saying this for years. However, the tired reply is that "Fisher had final say on personel." I also argued that... then Snead was being paid to do nothing, but everyone seems to want to see what he can do without Fisher's involvement. The Snisher regime set the Rams back a decade, and nothing will improve until they get some REAL football guys in charge. Snead is not that.
  • Massimo
    Rookie
    Posts: 431
    Joined: 09 Mar 2016, 06:55

    Re: Was The Offseason Strategy Driven By Les Snead's Desire To Save His Job?

    by Massimo » 18 Jul 2017, 05:47

    Fisher has become the teams scapegoat..all decisions were on him...even not drafting Wagner was part of that plan..Fisher really wanted Isaiah Pead all along...and when Fisher had to ask Demoff's premission to draft Mo Alexander in the 4th rd he was only pretending. Fisher only wanted to make Demoff feel important.


    yep, Fisher had total control alright
    Fisher also wanted Quick, GRob and Tavon at whatever cost...oh yeah, Jared Goff as well.
  • poplarbluffman
    Bench Warmer
    Posts: 1195
    Joined: 23 Jan 2016, 09:02

    Re: Was The Offseason Strategy Driven By Les Snead's Desire To Save His Job?

    by poplarbluffman » 18 Jul 2017, 08:31

    add another name to the growing list of vet players added by Snead to save his job..the 31(Oct) year old Connor Barwin 2 straight season of declining stats.. feel free to do a sacks search and look at the age of all the productive players. Likely another one and done player
    where's the rebuild? like wildflecken said why pass on Zeitler? Long term solution is to build around top players entering their 2nd contract and draft bpa at need positions
  • Ants
    Bench Warmer
    Posts: 1177
    Joined: 27 Jan 2016, 05:57

    Re: Was The Offseason Strategy Driven By Les Snead's Desire To Save His Job?

    by Ants » 18 Jul 2017, 09:53

    add another name to the growing list of vet players added by Snead to save his job..the 31(Oct) year old Connor Barwin 2 straight season of declining stats.. feel free to do a sacks search and look at the age of all the productive players. Likely another one and done player
    :roll: Yeah, and you can feel free to see how in those last 2 years he was playing down in a 4-3, not in a 3-4 where he excels. But don't let facts get in the way of your hate. :lol:
    :idea: Let's win some games.
  • Wildflecken
    Bench Warmer
    Posts: 1138
    Joined: 03 Feb 2016, 04:07

    Re: Was The Offseason Strategy Driven By Les Snead's Desire To Save His Job?

    by Wildflecken » 19 Jul 2017, 02:25

    add another name to the growing list of vet players added by Snead to save his job..the 31(Oct) year old Connor Barwin 2 straight season of declining stats.. feel free to do a sacks search and look at the age of all the productive players. Likely another one and done player
    where's the rebuild? like wildflecken said why pass on Zeitler? Long term solution is to build around top players entering their 2nd contract and draft bpa at need positions
    Spot on analysis. If they do not make playoffs in 2017 then it will have been the wrong approach this past off season. If they do Kudos to Snead however will it be sustainable or a one and done run until they rebuild the key positions currently filled with players on the wrong side of 30? To make it sustainable they will have to be active once again in FA next off season and once they sign Donald do they have the cap space to accomplish?

    I understand the challenges of going into a season without a solid plan at LOT but personally if it was my decision I would of tried to fit Zeitler and Whitworth both into the equation and tried to move Saffold or the more likely scenario, I would not of tagged Tru. I would of let him sign elsewhere. Doubt he is a Ram after this season anyway. Draft was filled with defensive backs. Rams could of added two cb's in first four rounds and still got McVay Everett and Kupp or Reynolds, one not both.
  • poplarbluffman
    Bench Warmer
    Posts: 1195
    Joined: 23 Jan 2016, 09:02

    Re: Was The Offseason Strategy Driven By Les Snead's Desire To Save His Job?

    by poplarbluffman » 19 Jul 2017, 04:28

    add another name to the growing list of vet players added by Snead to save his job..the 31(Oct) year old Connor Barwin 2 straight season of declining stats.. feel free to do a sacks search and look at the age of all the productive players. Likely another one and done player
    :roll: Yeah, and you can feel free to see how in those last 2 years he was playing down in a 4-3, not in a 3-4 where he excels. But don't let facts get in the way of your hate. :lol:
    I don't hate anything..just know logic which you avoided,,,Barwin being 31in Oct which you avoided talking about because of your blind fanaticism..sad

    want to gain some respect in my eyes talk about who decided and the logic of adding Sullivan, Barwin and Whitworth to a losing team? McVay(all new HC hires) are given 2/3 years to turn a team around...all 3 will likely be one and done..basically I can guarantee it...

    in my world McVay should continue dumping garbage like Robinson( McVay and his coaches don't carry magic wands and can't turn bad players into good ones) and accept a awful 2017 season. Either end up with a top 5 pick in 2018 or make another RG3 trade and end up with mega picks. Team could of signed Zeitler and made the Bills an offer for Ryan Groy they couldn't match. Both entering their prime. already had a top 10 D drafted a cb with that #2 pick would make them a top 5 Super Bowl quality D and adding Zeitler and Groy would of given them a great running game for Gurley and protection for Goff giving him time to develop


    want to impress me explain the logic of McVay signing over the hill players and changing a very good 4-3 team into a 3-4 team for an very old DC who won't be back in 2018 in his 1st year in a rebuild

    also address the op question of who is behind this win now philosophy? Snead or McVay
  • TBUX
    Bench Warmer
    Posts: 2001
    Joined: 27 Jan 2016, 14:32

    Re: Was The Offseason Strategy Driven By Les Snead's Desire To Save His Job?

    by TBUX » 19 Jul 2017, 07:25

    Maybe McVay and Snead don't consider this a rebuild?? maybe they didn't like Zeitler for this offense at the money he would have commanded? Many factors many aren't considering. One thing he wanted to do clearly=- get weapons for his young QB. Not a bad idea at all. I LOVE Kupp- think he is going to be a really good pro. Why are we bashing a guy like Barwin? last he played in a 3-4 he played quite well. Low cost vet- could be a nice move when all is said and done. Hard to argue with basically leaving the D alone and trying to improve the leagues worst O. How about we see what they do with their new guys and plan?
  • TBUX
    Bench Warmer
    Posts: 2001
    Joined: 27 Jan 2016, 14:32

    Re: Was The Offseason Strategy Driven By Les Snead's Desire To Save His Job?

    by TBUX » 19 Jul 2017, 07:28

    Oh and doubt they could have afforded paying both Zeitler and Groy. Not to mention how do you know they didn't go after, and how do you know if they didn't want to come here or if they did? Many ifs people are ASSUMING in this thread. Clearly they don't think this is a rebuild- and neither do I.
  • crazy-legs
    Bench Warmer
    Posts: 1232
    Joined: 13 Jan 2016, 10:49

    Re: Was The Offseason Strategy Driven By Les Snead's Desire To Save His Job?

    by crazy-legs » 19 Jul 2017, 08:38

    I think Snead had his hand in the pot but I think Fisher had final say...

    I prefer a structure where the HC has input but the GM has final say - from hiring the HC too the draft, FA and UDFA. I think that authority should be clearly defined...

    The last time the Rams had a GM with final say was Armey and that worked out pretty darn well...
    Judge our new coach in his third year. After all our last coach was to game strategy what Yoko Ono was to the Beatles...
  • Wildflecken
    Bench Warmer
    Posts: 1138
    Joined: 03 Feb 2016, 04:07

    Re: Was The Offseason Strategy Driven By Les Snead's Desire To Save His Job?

    by Wildflecken » 20 Jul 2017, 02:57

    Oh and doubt they could have afforded paying both Zeitler and Groy. Not to mention how do you know they didn't go after, and how do you know if they didn't want to come here or if they did? Many ifs people are ASSUMING in this thread. Clearly they don't think this is a rebuild- and neither do I.
    Personally I see it as football fans and fans with interest in the Rams as discussing different scenarios for the offseason strategy and giving their personal or opposing view. Will is change what they did, nope. Highly doubt any offense running a power gap would not want Zeitler on roster.

    However there is another factor that could of played into this strategy, a strategy that brought in players who could only play one season and come off cap for 2018, that strategy being freeing up the cap space to enter into the Kirk Cousins sweepstakes. A philosophy I posted a thread on some time ago. Does Goff only get one season to prove he is developing into a franchise qb?
  • poplarbluffman
    Bench Warmer
    Posts: 1195
    Joined: 23 Jan 2016, 09:02

    Re: Was The Offseason Strategy Driven By Les Snead's Desire To Save His Job?

    by poplarbluffman » 20 Jul 2017, 09:41

    or is the win now philosophy coming from higher up then Snead? Rams are the 3rd worst franchise in California. Can you guess where the rich will want to spend their weekend? In Las Vegas gambling followed by watching a elite Raiders team playing on Sunday or watching the worst franchise in football, the Rams, in La?

    also doubt Snead/McVay will be more tempting to Cousins then Lynch/Shanahan. Rams won't win that battle. Whether from Kroenke or Snead obvious Rams are trying to win now and willing to accept a bigger rebuild later

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: bigklein and 13 guests