Ramsey Update

ocram23 · Post by **ocram23** » February 21st, 2023, 9:02 am

there is way too much noise right now about the eventual departure of Ramsey. LA Sports talk yesterday was even talking about the possible release of JR.
I think we all need to realize the chances of him coming back are pretty slim. With Morris coming back as the DC I think this is a good move for the Rams. Morris doesn't use him in the scheme he should be playing which is man to man.
Due to the Rams being in Cap hell I think this is going to be 1 of many moves the Rams will make to get under the cap.

Thoughts???

Cornell29 · Post by **Cornell29** » February 21st, 2023, 9:12 am

If a team offers a deal that the rams can't refuse, like a mid 1st round pick or a late 1st round pick and a 3rd. I'm good with it.

The rams won't save much this year but will in 2024 and beyond. With that said, it all depends on if and how big the rams hit on the pick(s) they obtained for JR.

DelMar · Post by **DelMar** » February 21st, 2023, 9:22 am

The biggest sticking point about all this is the dead cap issue. I just don't see how it's worth it in any way, shape or form.

If we let him go now, it's a $32M hit. BUT, if we wait till next season, its only $11M

ocram23 · Post by **ocram23** » February 21st, 2023, 9:30 am

DelMar wrote: ↑February 21st, 2023, 9:22 am The biggest sticking point about all this is the dead cap issue. I just don't see how it's worth it in any way, shape or form.

If we let him go now, it's a $32M hit. BUT, if we wait till next season, its only $11M

so there isn't a certain date that if we release him the number goes significantly down???

DelMar · Post by **DelMar** » February 21st, 2023, 9:40 am

ocram23 wrote: ↑February 21st, 2023, 9:30 am
DelMar wrote: ↑February 21st, 2023, 9:22 am The biggest sticking point about all this is the dead cap issue. I just don't see how it's worth it in any way, shape or form.

If we let him go now, it's a $32M hit. BUT, if we wait till next season, its only $11M
so there isn't a certain date that if we release him the number goes significantly down???

I do not believe the dead cap changes.

D-GenerationX · Post by **D-GenerationX** » February 21st, 2023, 9:42 am

If they trade him for a Day 2 pick (no one is giving you a first, get real) then the Rams are fools.

wildram01 · Post by **wildram01** » February 21st, 2023, 9:42 am

DelMar wrote: ↑February 21st, 2023, 9:22 am The biggest sticking point about all this is the dead cap issue. I just don't see how it's worth it in any way, shape or form.

If we let him go now, it's a $32M hit. BUT, if we wait till next season, its only $11M

Overthecap.com has it at $19 million dead money in 2023 if he is traded pre-June 1, and that would completely clear him from the books for 2024 (I think), when Ramsey is currently scheduled to have a $26.7 million cap number. I hate to say it, but we might be taking on some dead money from a retired Stafford and AD at that point, so not having any leftover from Ramsey would help in 2024. The Rams have shown a willingness to absorb dead money if they think it's in the long term interest of the team. I was definitely one of the "they will never cut Gurley" crowd in the 2020 offseason, thinking they would rather pay him to play at a shell of himself than pay him not to play at all, but we saw how that and the Goff situation worked out. Could wait until after June 1 and split the cap hit, but we don't get to use a draft pick in 2023 to replace him. I think any suggestion that he is just outright cut is ridiculous.

ocram23 · Post by **ocram23** » February 21st, 2023, 9:46 am

D-GenerationX wrote: ↑February 21st, 2023, 9:42 am If they trade him for a Day 2 pick (no one is giving you a first, get real) then the Rams are fools.

I agree with you there is no way Rams will get a #1 for him. This is probably the sticking point right now. I think McVay needs to sit Morris down and tell him to go back to playing man/man coverage with him.

wildram01 · Post by **wildram01** » February 21st, 2023, 9:54 am

D-GenerationX wrote: ↑February 21st, 2023, 9:42 am If they trade him for a Day 2 pick (no one is giving you a first, get real) then the Rams are fools.

I'm not so sure they couldn't get a mid to late first from a team that thinks they are on the edge of being a legit Super Bowl contender. The most obvious would be Detroit and their own first round pick (we won't get our top 10 back for him), because of the Holmes connection. Ramsey is under contract for three more years. He's not cheap, but probably cheaper than signing a top CB in free agency and more of a sure thing than drafting a CB. Detroit spent a top ten pick on Okudah and he has been a bust, so why not use a lower pick to get a proven player at their biggest area of need on defense? But I do agree, if it's not a day 1 pick then just hang onto him.

RAMFAN71 · Post by **RAMFAN71** » February 21st, 2023, 11:55 am

I think he's absolutely a 1st round pick. If they trade for less, then stupid I agree. He's not TGII with the bad leg. He's not Goff. It's not JR holding back Morris and his genius scheme of "back up to the 15 yard line and then start playing defense". Other way around.....

ocram23 · Post by **ocram23** » February 21st, 2023, 12:11 pm

RAMFAN71 wrote: ↑February 21st, 2023, 11:55 am I think he's absolutely a 1st round pick. If they trade for less, then stupid I agree. He's not TGII with the bad leg. He's not Goff. It's not JR holding back Morris and his genius scheme of "back up to the 15 yard line and then start playing defense". Other way around.....

I think his contract is the issue

Hacksaw · Post by **Hacksaw** » February 21st, 2023, 12:14 pm

DelMar wrote: ↑February 21st, 2023, 9:22 am The biggest sticking point about all this is the dead cap issue. I just don't see how it's worth it in any way, shape or form.

If we let him go now, it's a $32M hit. BUT, if we wait till next season, its only $11M

If that's accurate then we have to trade him and his contract. Otherwise hes worth more to us just staying on the roster.

Post by **UplandRam** » February 21st, 2023, 1:33 pm

If the only issue is the Rams trying to get cap room, then cutting Leonard Floyd and restructuring a few contracts make much more sense than trading or cutting him.

GoldenRam · Post by **GoldenRam** » February 21st, 2023, 2:17 pm

ocram23 wrote: ↑February 21st, 2023, 9:02 am there is way too much noise right now about the eventual departure of Ramsey. LA Sports talk yesterday was even talking about the possible release of JR.
I think we all need to realize the chances of him coming back are pretty slim. With Morris coming back as the DC I think this is a good move for the Rams. Morris doesn't use him in the scheme he should be playing which is man to man.
Due to the Rams being in Cap hell I think this is going to be 1 of many moves the Rams will make to get under the cap.

Thoughts???

Not crazy about this at all. Take weak area and then make it weaker.
Well, let's just do that at every level. We can suck balls for a few years and accumulate draft picks and marginal talent.

The Rams secondary is already paper thin. So sure, let's remove a guy who despite not being used wisely had an 86 PFF rating, led the Rams
in defensive turnovers and gave up less than 40 ypg.

Not a chance we get equal value as far as CB play next season, but hey, we still have Kendrick. Also have Rochell Durant, Hill and can always hang on to the great one .. DL, jr. as well as what rooks we can grab in the draft.

The likelihood that the Rams would use that money wisely is also not all that great, imo. I can see them paying for another shiny new toy for McV, and then overpay for a defensive player, then scrape the barrel for some scraps with whatever is left.

In point of fact, given the way salaries trend, $25 mil won't bring much at the NFL supermarket. I think some of that money can be obtained buy dumping or trading dudes we *already* overpaid, which brings me back the paragraph above this one. The Rams have not shown themselves to be good in money management and taking an asset we need, who is still among the top at his position, weakening our D even further to give them "found"money to play with, doesn't bode well, imo

GoldenRam · Post by **GoldenRam** » February 21st, 2023, 2:23 pm

Cornell29 wrote: ↑February 21st, 2023, 9:12 am If a team offers a deal that the rams can't refuse, like a mid 1st round pick or a late 1st round pick and a 3rd. I'm good with it.

The rams won't save much this year but will in 2024 and beyond. With that said, it all depends on if and how big the rams hit on the pick(s) they obtained for JR.

The picks they are more likely to trade than use themselves. Which would make it all about who they acquire when they trade those picks, and who they trade them to. If they could identify rightly identify a team that will suck worse than us, and trade for whatever player and *their* FRP, could be interesting.

At the risk of sucking one more year, I can see them working around some sort of strategy to get is up into CW sweepstakes territory.

GoldenRam · Post by **GoldenRam** » February 21st, 2023, 2:28 pm

DelMar wrote: ↑February 21st, 2023, 9:22 am The biggest sticking point about all this is the dead cap issue. I just don't see how it's worth it in any way, shape or form.

If we let him go now, it's a $32M hit. BUT, if we wait till next season, its only $11M

Holy Hell of a point!

There is the A number 1 concrete written in stone reason not to do
it, which gets back to my money management point in a previous post. No point in shitting their knickers to the tune of $21 mil over one more season.

I still would prefer they just tell Morris, play to the dudes strengths instead of your whims

malibu · Post by **malibu** » February 21st, 2023, 2:39 pm

ocram23 wrote: ↑February 21st, 2023, 9:46 am
D-GenerationX wrote: ↑February 21st, 2023, 9:42 am If they trade him for a Day 2 pick (no one is giving you a first, get real) then the Rams are fools.
I agree with you there is no way Rams will get a #1 for him. This is probably the sticking point right now. I think McVay needs to sit Morris down and tell him to go back to playing man/man coverage with him.

Completely disagree he is arguably the top CB in the NFL or at a minimum top 3. He is still in his prime. We had to give up 2 1sts for him. He is worth a 1st and a 3rd rounder imo at the least. Or why let him go?

Most of all like I keep saying you trade away big assets when you have players behind the player who can replace him without much dropoff. The Rams have too much dropoff from Ramsey to the next best CB. With Hill leaving most likely you want Durant, Kendricks and maybe a FA or draft pick to be our DB corp I sure don't.

If it was an insane offer sure but we all doubt it is that. Most of all by downgrading the DBs almost instantly ruins our chances at going for a title. With AD gone in 1 -2 years that would not be good. There are projected 6 DBs to go in the first this year, who knows who will be the stud of the bunch that seems super risky to trade a proven NFL top 3 cb for a unknown 1st rounder considering 50% are busts.

Cornell29 · Post by **Cornell29** » February 21st, 2023, 2:44 pm

If Ramsey is traded
On L.A.’s end, they would be getting $5.6 million in salary cap relief for 2023, but also an astounding $18.5 million in salary cap relief for 2024.

BrooklynRam74 · Post by **BrooklynRam74** » February 21st, 2023, 3:17 pm

Cutting him, and the cap hit that comes with it doesn't make much sense.

However, this item below should be considered...

Jalen Ramsey trade rumors: Detroit Lions make sense for LA Rams deal - Turf Show Times
https://www.turfshowtimes.com/2023/2/21 ... raft-picks

DelMar · Post by **DelMar** » February 21st, 2023, 3:50 pm

Or this Brooklyn....(Per PFF)

LOS ANGELES RAMS CB JALEN RAMSEY → MIAMI DOLPHINS

Trade compensation: Rams send 2023 5th (compensatory); acquire 2023 2nd, 2024 2nd
Contract acquired: Three years, $55 million ($12.5 million total guaranteed)
The Dolphins have been among the most aggressive teams in the NFL over the past few offseasons, notably trading first-round picks for wide receiver Tyreek Hill and edge defender Bradley Chubb over the course of the 2022 season. Why stop there?

Despite the Dolphins already dealing with a handful of big contracts, quarterback Tua Tagovailoa will be on the fourth year of his rookie deal in 2023 and Miami can clear a ton of cap space with a few obvious restructures and cuts. A notable cut that would likely be a precursor to this move is the Dolphins moving on from cornerback Byron Jones, who missed the entire 2022 campaign and whose release, if designated a post-June 1 release, could clear $13.6 million in 2023 cap space.

Ramsey played college football at Florida State and began his NFL career with the Jacksonville Jaguars, so he continues his football journey back in Florida with new defensive coordinator Vic Fangio. Fangio’s zone-heavy defensive scheme has already proven to be a great fit for Ramsey, with Fangio disciple Brandon Staley coaching Ramsey with the Los Angeles Rams in 2020. Fangio could deploy Ramsey as the “Star” in the defense with Xavien Howard staying out wide. That would allow the Dolphins to get the most out of Ramsey in the slot, down in the box and, really, all over the formation.

Ramsey’s cumulative 90.6 coverage grade over the past three seasons ranks second among cornerbacks, and his 91.2 run-defense grade ranks first. His 80.3 coverage grade from the slot over the past three seasons ranks fifth. There are a lot of elite, young cornerbacks in the league right now, but Ramsey still holds the crown as the best defensive back in the NFL as of today.

Newly inducted Hall of Fame cornerback Darrelle Revis was traded to the Tampa Bay Buccaneers for first- and conditional fourth-round picks entering his age-28 season, where he then signed what was effectively a one-year deal for $16 million. Here, Ramsey is traded for two second-round picks entering his age-29 season, three-and-a-half years after the Rams acquired him for two first-round picks.

DelMar · Post by **DelMar** » February 21st, 2023, 4:06 pm

Does anyone know for a FACT in here what happens w the DEAD CAP for sure IF we do trade Jalen, or anyone under contract? My understanding is that the $32M will hit our CAP and that's HUGE. This is why we have to keep him imo. Then trade next season for only $11M Dead Cap hit.

Am I missing something?

DelMar · Post by **DelMar** » February 21st, 2023, 4:38 pm

Who in here thinks JR is the TOP CB in the game right now?

Hello... Bueller, Bueller, Bueller... Nothing but crickets.

Reason I ask this, is that he will be the second highest paid CB in ALL of football this coming season. To me, he's (MAYBE) top 15 but NOT top one or two.

I guess i'm just annoyed we are paying Ramsey $25M this season. Can't believe we wrote up a contract like this and it was approved.

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/rankings/20 ... k/cap-hit/

ocram23 · Post by **ocram23** » February 22nd, 2023, 8:55 am

DelMar wrote: ↑February 21st, 2023, 4:38 pm Who in here thinks JR is the TOP CB in the game right now?

Hello... Bueller, Bueller, Bueller... Nothing but crickets.

Reason I ask this, is that he will be the second highest paid CB in ALL of football this coming season. To me, he's (MAYBE) top 15 but NOT top one or two.

I guess i'm just annoyed we are paying Ramsey $25M this season. Can't believe we wrote up a contract like this and it was approved.

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/rankings/20 ... k/cap-hit/

I think Morris uses him the wrong way, soft zone coverages, and to JR's fault he isn't as engaged as he should be. I do believe they should trade him for one reason....this is not a playoff team so get underneath the cap, get more draft picks and rebuild this roster. I am tired of hearing all this crap how good this team is going to be next year, blah blah blah. we have too many holes and too little draft picks.

Cornell29 · Post by **Cornell29** » February 22nd, 2023, 10:10 am

ocram23 wrote: ↑February 22nd, 2023, 8:55 am
DelMar wrote: ↑February 21st, 2023, 4:38 pm Who in here thinks JR is the TOP CB in the game right now?

Hello... Bueller, Bueller, Bueller... Nothing but crickets.

Reason I ask this, is that he will be the second highest paid CB in ALL of football this coming season. To me, he's (MAYBE) top 15 but NOT top one or two.

I guess i'm just annoyed we are paying Ramsey $25M this season. Can't believe we wrote up a contract like this and it was approved.

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/rankings/20 ... k/cap-hit/
I think Morris uses him the wrong way, soft zone coverages, and to JR's fault he isn't as engaged as he should be. I do believe they should trade him for one reason....this is not a playoff team so get underneath the cap, get more draft picks and rebuild this roster. I am tired of hearing all this crap how good this team is going to be next year, blah blah blah. we have too many holes and too little draft picks.

DelMar · Post by **DelMar** » February 22nd, 2023, 10:14 am

Cornell29 wrote: ↑February 22nd, 2023, 10:10 am
ocram23 wrote: ↑February 22nd, 2023, 8:55 am

I think Morris uses him the wrong way, soft zone coverages, and to JR's fault he isn't as engaged as he should be. I do believe they should trade him for one reason....this is not a playoff team so get underneath the cap, get more draft picks and rebuild this roster. I am tired of hearing all this crap how good this team is going to be next year, blah blah blah. we have too many holes and too little draft picks.

Well Kelly better be ready!

BrooklynRam74 · Post by **BrooklynRam74** » February 22nd, 2023, 11:09 am

Cornell29 wrote: ↑February 22nd, 2023, 10:10 am
ocram23 wrote: ↑February 22nd, 2023, 8:55 am

I think Morris uses him the wrong way, soft zone coverages, and to JR's fault he isn't as engaged as he should be. I do believe they should trade him for one reason....this is not a playoff team so get underneath the cap, get more draft picks and rebuild this roster. I am tired of hearing all this crap how good this team is going to be next year, blah blah blah. we have too many holes and too little draft picks.

Stafford SAYS it, I BELIEVE it.

Stafford is the MAN.

Yorkshire Ram · Post by **Yorkshire Ram** » February 22nd, 2023, 11:16 am

Morris is coming back. On that basis, regardless of JRs skills, he won't be able to utilise them.

We are paying massive money for a guy who might be worth it if used correctly but he won't be. Therefore, he's a waste of money.

Shop him and get a first and another valuable pick. It hurts to say it but it's the only thing that makes sense.

GoldenRam · Post by **GoldenRam** » February 22nd, 2023, 12:32 pm

DelMar wrote: ↑February 21st, 2023, 4:38 pm Who in here thinks JR is the TOP CB in the game right now?

Hello... Bueller, Bueller, Bueller... Nothing but crickets.

Reason I ask this, is that he will be the second highest paid CB in ALL of football this coming season. To me, he's (MAYBE) top 15 but NOT top one or two.

I guess i'm just annoyed we are paying Ramsey $25M this season. Can't believe we wrote up a contract like this and it was approved.

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/rankings/20 ... k/cap-hit/

I disagree with him not being top 5. I think the reason he doesn't look like it is because he's being used incorrectly, Also, I'd like to see the 14 CB's who bested his under 40 yards given up per game last season. I think most people are letting their annoyance over his contract #'s color their view JR. Do I wish we had more cap, and he maybe made a little less, sure .. but the Rams paid it, so take some out on them as well. I don't think JR and a 5th for two 2nd's is value for us, and beyond that .. then what for secondary? We have Hill. Durant, Kendricks, Rochell, Long jr., stop me when I name someone who DC's aren't drooling over targeting. Course we add some rooks, I doubt we use that money for FA CB's, which means using more draft capital than we might want to draft more CB's at the expense of lineman on both sides of the ball as well as edge

CierraRam · Post by **CierraRam** » February 22nd, 2023, 12:51 pm

UplandRam wrote: ↑February 21st, 2023, 1:33 pm If the only issue is the Rams trying to get cap room, then cutting Leonard Floyd and restructuring a few contracts make much more sense than trading or cutting him.

Was gonna say the same.... In order for a Ramsey trade to make any kind of sense to the Rams financially they would have to do it Post June 1st. And that obviously doesnt help their draft this season. I happen to like what they have at corner without Ramsey as I still think Kendricks will pan out to be an above average corner even though he took his lumps last year. Thats to be expected at the position unless you're a generational type player like a Sauce Gardner. I loved Durants play as well as a rookie. Hopefully they will have Troy Hill again... and they'll have to find a solid spot 4 in that group from somewhere if not within the depth chart already. But I really dont see anything happening with Ramsey for this season and he will be a Ram.

ocram23 · Post by **ocram23** » February 22nd, 2023, 1:20 pm

BrooklynRam74 wrote: ↑February 22nd, 2023, 11:09 am
Cornell29 wrote: ↑February 22nd, 2023, 10:10 am

Stafford SAYS it, I BELIEVE it.

Stafford is the MAN.

love the optimism but the easter bunny coming to my house has a better chance. this roster is no where near SB caliber.

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